Another View of Tucker

Someone sent me this map of Tucker, apparently as a once-upon-a-time proposal.

I want to thank whoever did it; I think it's a pretty good model.

Something like the dark blue, possibly a little smaller, would be a slam dunk for the creation of a city. Adding the rest, maybe not so much.

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Leslie Griffith January 27, 2014 at 04:52 PM
Apologies... Cut & paste did not separate the paragraphs in that last post.
Leslie Griffith January 27, 2014 at 05:04 PM
Jim- thanks for your post. Part of the reason I live in unincorporated Dekalb was to NOT live in City of Atlanta limits. To be clearer on my part, new cities are not necessarily a bad idea to Dekalb’s problems. But the way the LCA tried to steamroll potential residents of their new city by not disclosing who was in the LCA, who financially backed it, rush the whole process, not answering questions from would-be residents and having a non-resident like Fran Millar back their efforts left a lot of us just smelling the same old sour rat of cronyism and self-interest trying to grow another head. Other solutions to Dekalb: 1): get rid of the CEO and executive assistant positions. Two less people we have to pay, less aggravation and scandal. 2): Dekalb has grown so much. I know we’ve all heard this before, but maybe make two counties of existing Dekalb. NOT suggesting a economic north/south split here. We are all in this together, like it or not. So maybe two that could be both viable and more accountable to a lesser number of residents who are likely to pay more attention, given the local nature.3): Question authority: How are decisions on any of the issues we are all troubled about decided? What is the chain of command? Who heads the department responsible for my concern and what is their DIRECT phone number? Dress up, walk in their office, smile, and don’t leave until you get what you came for. 4): Call the news. And keep calling! My neighbors and I stopped Atlanta Gas Light from claiming eminent domain over our properties prior to their Eastside Pipeline project with research and tenacity. County, City, Township, Corporation… all are entities responsible to us. Referendums can be tricky indeed. From what I’ve read, the City of Brookhaven had 49,000 residents qualified to vote on incorporation and only 20,000 voted for/against cityhood. It passed, so about ½ of the people affected by this decision actually voted on it. Of those voting, 55% voted for cityhood. That means around 25% of everyone affected by this decision voted for cityhood, sure to raise more squabbles, headaches, TAXES for all affected. Blame voter responsibility if you want, but we all know “special elections” are decided by their proponents: local SPLOST, booze, lottery, whatever. They just bulldoze their wishes through. Regards, Leslie
Keith Hanks January 27, 2014 at 05:20 PM
@Brian fair enough on the $20... I've been advised to hide by Yankee background and I am on the record that if left to me the financial plan should revolve around a Dunkin Donuts being installed at every major intersection... Don't mean to bring up the township thing as a distraction. I know some northern and midwestern states have them. I don't remember them in MA, maybe western MA where there's towns of 800 - 5,000 people, maybe. What you often see on the signs up there is one of the following dates when you cross a border: 1) Established, or 2) Incorporated... Honestly can't say in MA I've seen anything in the 1900s either. Most was 1700s, some 1800s and even 1600s.
Keith Hanks January 27, 2014 at 05:26 PM
And to add some much needed humor and stick to Dunkin Donuts. Northlake has one Dunkin Donuts. It's actually one of my least favorite ones in the metro area. Charges for syrup, which is weird, and overcharges on everything else while too frequently getting orders wrong. My Yankee logic says Northlake could easily manage 2-3 Dunkin Donuts, at least another one ITP, and OTP needs one along Northlake Parkway.
Keith Hanks January 27, 2014 at 05:28 PM
To close out the Dunkin Donuts topic, another two are needed along Lawrenceville Highway. One near the Home Depot ITP, and one closer towards the Wal-Mart. Possibly a third by Mountain Industrial.
Brian January 27, 2014 at 06:43 PM
Dunkin Donuts on the way in Tucker: http://tucker.patch.com/groups/business-news/p/dunkin-donutsbaskin-robins-planning-tucker-location
Cheryl Miller January 27, 2014 at 06:51 PM
LOL! This is the home of Krispy Kreme, remember?
Tom Doolittle January 27, 2014 at 07:24 PM
There are many reasons Georgia law (as well as all original Southern colonies) is different than New England. They don't have strong county units. Trying to justify "towns" or "townships" here would warrant looking at Southern states where large provinces of land were originally granted to the elite. Virginia is a good model, where there are many categories of "settlements"--almost done on a tailored basis...and counties are extremely strong. My home--"town" is Manassas, which had a population over 25,000 before it went from Town to City--in 1980. The Town of Vienna in Fairfax County 15,000 has as many services as Sandy Springs and high quality of life. The difference between towns and cities is the ablity to have school systems. There are state-sanctioned "unincorprated communities" (benefits and functions?). I all cases, the boundaries are highly compact--the notion of forming a 50,000 person city would be ludicrous on residential territory alone. Reston Virginia (50,000) has existed as a residential "unincorporated community" for 50 years with all volunteer committees running everything. Of course Fairfax County may be the most well-run jurisdiction in the nation.
Cheryl Miller January 27, 2014 at 07:32 PM
Tom, that Wikipedia link you gave on another post was very interesting to read. Thank you. I noticed that "City-Lite" was not mentioned anywhere but it was the standard response whenever someone would ask about whether or not there was a process for forming a township or similar. It also mentioned that a CID was a common start to what would eventually become a city. No where did it mention anything about politicians creating a proposal and then attempting to rally the taxpayers around a variety of issues in order to gain their support.
Tom Doolittle January 27, 2014 at 07:36 PM
Cheryl--Where did I provide a link? Anyway--no--the legislative process in Virginia is something that has no resemblance to ours, nor is the Commonwealth charter. The people here have completely lost their minds.
Leslie Griffith January 27, 2014 at 07:59 PM
@ Cheryl: huh ???
Rhea A Johnson Jr January 27, 2014 at 10:01 PM
Just woke up from my afternoon nap after a stress filled day under the Gold Dome. I have a lot of news to report on DeKalb City-hood; unfortunately most of the news is confidential at this time, but a clue is a post by newsy don earlier. More tomorrow.
Leslie Griffith January 28, 2014 at 12:59 AM
Wow Rhea, thanks! I'm on the edge of my seat and biting my nails in suspense.
Rhea A Johnson Jr January 28, 2014 at 06:43 AM
OK Leslie...here's the poop,the scoop, the skinny(as we used to say back in the '50s). At the first DeKalb County Legislative Delegation Luncheon of the new session,the menu was as follows....Butternut Squash Ravioli with Brown Butter Champagne Sauce,Chicken Florentine with shaved truffle - Wines...A clean,crisp,dry Sancerre from Franc's Loire Valley, a softer style white from the Entre-du-Mers in Southwest frog land and a charming white from Northern Italy squeezed from the grapes of a pre Roman endangered species. The vintage-2012-was the best since Italy's greatest- 123BC(unlike DeKalb County they keep good records). I work 24/7 for you guys(and girls). Lunch was provided by Mac,Ken & Long who had just signed an 8 week lobbying contract(170K)with DeKalb County. I sat next to a charming young lady(ALL women are considered young at my age)who is intensely involved in the city-hood movement in DeKalb County. The GOOD NEWS; the potential now exists for the possibility of a provisional reconciliation between Lakeside and Briarcliff. At least one new map will be released to the general public later in the week! More later.
Cheryl Miller January 28, 2014 at 07:25 AM
Great... Let me guess... LaVista Hills, right? This is becoming a bit toooo predictable!
doddave January 28, 2014 at 08:43 AM
I hope Rhea's map is better than his meal BS. Peachtree Creek would make a perfectly logical southern border, without disrupting neighborhoods. An alternate would be the RR tracks. Anything that follows some form of logic rather than grabbing, and doesn't mess with ATL, Decatur, Avondale and Clarkston.
doddave January 28, 2014 at 08:46 AM
Cheryl, are you on something? I know those were sort of sentences, but it helps to have some type of meaning...
Patricia Killingsworth January 28, 2014 at 10:43 AM
In my humble opinion, both the legislative delegation and the county commissioners have made it clear that they have no interest in creating any new cities. HB 692 and HB 833 not only support a moratorium, they also make specific references to geographic limitations on future municipalities. When plotted out, those seemingly reasonable limitations will actually make it virtually impossible to create a financially viable new city in DeKalb in the future. I think that the real stumbling blocks, even beyond the fact that no boundary agreements exist between Lakeside, Briarcliff and Tucker, are the proposed annexations by current municipalities and the possibility of future annexations by the City of Atlanta. There are so many moving parts here that a moratorium (which would hopefully include an independent study of unincorporated/municipality/township/annexation benefits to county residents) is the likely result. To further complicate matters, a City of South Fulton bill (which will have a significant impact on Atlanta and any future annexation plans they might have) has also been introduced into the legislature. If none of the proposed cities can reach an agreement on their boundaries by the end of this week, I believe that they will have doomed themselves to failure. I am sharing my thoughts on the matter, not to state my personal preference, but to add to the conversation.
Tom Doolittle January 28, 2014 at 01:18 PM
Patricia: Regarding your description of the powerful interests' annexation "reservations", I agree completely. Folks here should understand that these are geopolitical decisions that involve people at even higher pay grades than most state legislators.
mikeatl January 28, 2014 at 03:08 PM
Patricia: Well put, but kind of negative (which might be accurate). You can do the math on this. The only workable solution that ends up in a city is Lakeside and Briarcliff joining in some way. Briarcliff and Tucker made a lot of sense a month or two ago, but not now. there's just no time in this legislative session to get anywhere with it. Briarcliff and Lakeside combining in some way (compromise isn't a four letter word), has the benefit of having a legislative sponsor, and having a large base of constituents in both groups. Somebody suggested Peachtree Creek or the RR tracks, or North Decatur Road. There's got to be some way to get to a deal. I want a city. That's doesn't mean a perfect city -- if we can get something that makes sense, that's better than nothing but a series of great ideas.
Patricia Killingsworth January 28, 2014 at 03:53 PM
First - I would like to correct an error in my previous post. HB 833 does not address the cityhood issue, but rather addresses the manner in which a governing authority can define and redevelop a "blighted" property. Given that the Emory area, by virtue of its plethora of unemployed persons (a/k/a students) living in overcrowded conditions (a/k/a dorms), currently qualifies as a "slum" for redevelopment purposes, even though that is clearly not the intent of the legislation, I am tracking the progress of that bill as well. Mike - A "workable solution" may not be out of the question, but my point is simply that the legislature does not appear to be in the mood to approve any new city this session for the reasons stated above. A compromise that results in some form of Briarcliff/Lakeside merger, without further feasibility studies and neighborhood input, seems unlikely to pass. And Tucker cannot be so easily dismissed. Is it possible - yes. Is it likely - no.
Leslie Griffith January 28, 2014 at 04:08 PM
So glad you had a nice lunch, Rhea. Thanks for the update.
Tom Doolittle January 28, 2014 at 04:38 PM
BTW Patricia: The Legislature has a record of "ordering" updated feasibility studies subsequent to new maps it requires. They did this in Brookhaven prior to Govt Affairs Comm approval and forward for General Assembly vote. As "luck" would have it, Vinson was pleased to provide the Phase 2 study "at no extra charge". The unbiased, no dog in the hunt Vinson would most certainly do the same here. Whether the Govt Affairs Committee would ask for a study here based on a map it devises (in other words "owns" the map)--or not is another question. If it basically were to say, "well, Briarcliff was feasible and Lakeside was feasible, the map that is within those areas most certainly is feasible" would be yet another case of convenient modifying rules midstream. But then again, if you have few rules in the first place, doing whatever you want isn't a modification. The lack of definition of process is an abomination. Other state legislatures would scratch their head or laugh--of course until our "boys" filled them in on the need to destroy county government autonomy in Democrat dominated counties. Then the other states would say--"Okayyyy, its your business, never seen it before, don't know how you've gotten to this point where a coup is needed but who are we to comment?"
Patricia Killingsworth January 28, 2014 at 05:46 PM
And Brookhaven is working so well......... Which presents us with another issue. After redrawing the city boundaries, Brookhaven came within an eyelash of losing their referendum (much to their surprise). Creating a new city out of some amalgamation of Briarcliff and Lakeside will undoubtedly upset a lot of residents who become disenfranchised as well as others who never wanted to be in a city in the first place, both of whom will lobby against the referendum whether or not they have a vote and may even be looking for a new representative come the fall. Getting through the legislature is only part of the battle, and, at the risk of repeating myself, the majority of our legislators clearly do not want to have to sort through all of the myriad issues during this session. I remain undecided on my position, but I am pretty certain that our legislators are not.
Tom Doolittle January 28, 2014 at 06:19 PM
I remain undecided on my position in a referendum vote--I am quite "decided" on changing the requirements for having referendums..and what level of plurality would indicate that a city is wanted by a meaningful % of the population in order to have a trusted and successful municipality (many points you've made). BTW--thanks for not using "myriad OF issues".
Rhea A Johnson Jr January 28, 2014 at 08:24 PM
Breaking News: Just got a phone call from a close friend suggesting that I go out in a parking lot and do some wheelies in the snow in my yellow Porsche! But I said NO,NO I am focused on city-hood in Central DeKalb!! In my short discussion with Fran after an OK lunch at the Capitol yesterday , my impression is that he wants to move his bill some time next week(just a guess). This means that we need to convince Briarcliff & Lakeside to strike a deal - not impossible , just ask a few thousand times between now and next week! I'm posting on Herman's Blob so stay informed. The "Public" needs to decide what map they want and present it to both groups. All maps I have ever produced were with input from the general public; I am not a member of any City-hood group nor do I OWN any map(or much else either). So....one week to decide on a map and all else falls neatly into place!
Todd Chester January 28, 2014 at 09:12 PM
Rhea. That's Idiocracy.
Rhea A Johnson Jr January 28, 2014 at 10:02 PM
Todd ....please explain????? Don't see that word in Webster.
Rhea A Johnson Jr January 29, 2014 at 05:58 AM
Just woke up.....looks like a great day for a compromise between COBI/Lakeside......lets get the conservation started...but first more coffee for me ....but have at it!
Rhea A Johnson Jr January 29, 2014 at 08:09 AM
Dang.....burned the coffee pot this morning...house smells like Smokey the Bear residence(60 units per acre under DeKalb's new zoning ordnance).


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