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UPDATE: Proposed City of Lavista Hills Map Surfaces

The map, created by North Druid Hills resident Rhea Johnson, was sent to a Tucker cityhood blog Sunday.

UPDATE [1:53 p.m.]: A map for a proposed City of Lavista Hills that appeared on a Tucker blog Sunday does not represent The North Druid Hills Study Group and is not formally connected to state Sen. Jason Carter, the group's leader said Monday afternoon.

Though the map's creator, North Druid Hills resident Rhea Johnson, has worked with The North Druid Hills Study Group, it does not represent the study group, said Don Broussard, the group's head. Johnson called Patch on Monday afternoon and said he sent the map to the Tucker Initiative blog as part of an ongoing discussion about what the boundaries between a proposed City of Tucker and an adjacent city west of I-285 might look like.

"It was related to the two-city conundrum that we seem to be in," Johnson said.

While he did give the map the Lavista Hills title, he said he does not know if Carter has seen it, and the draft was not meant for public discussion. The draft was discussed within the study group, Broussard said, but it was nixed because it showed too much detail with regard to council districts, and the study group found the map's taxing ideas too controversial and unlikely to gain wide support.

FIRST POST [10:49 a.m.]: A map for a proposed City of Lavista Hills appeared on a Tucker blog over the weekend.

The map, which was posted on The City of Tucker Intiative, was created by local resident Rhea Johnson and The North Druid Hills Study Group, which proposed a City of Briarcliff in March.

The City of Lavista Hills map, which would ideally be attached the cityhood legislation filed by Decatur state Sen. Jason Carter earlier this month, is very similar to the study group's map. But it would also include the Scottdale area and all of North Decatur up to the City of Decatur's boundaries, ensuring Decatur could not stretch its boundaries north.

Other details from the proposed City of Lavista Hills:

  • Estimated population of 92,824
  • Estimated appraised value of $9.7 billion
  • City services: public safety, planning and zoning, parks and recreation

What do you think about the proposed City of Lavista Hills? Tell us in the comments section below.

aaronnatl April 22, 2013 at 05:56 PM
Randy, Trust me I don't need a lecture on property values and why some are higher then others. My point is you pay more in taxes for the same size house as someone below 78 because your house is worth more. If you want to pay the same I would suggest you move back get the same size house. Yes they have more services and as a result do not pay into fulton county for them. Still taxes are higher. Also didn't I just see Dunwoody wants to add fire as a service? That did not take long. How much longer until you can no longer use them as an example of cheaper taxes?
RandyRand April 22, 2013 at 05:57 PM
You are right that I am NOT speaking on behalf of the LCA. However, I believe that being selective in its mapping efforts is one of the best thing LCA has going for it! Having more border residents now wanting in is an enviable position for any potential city. Tucker is welcome to use some form of social justice in it’s mapping criteria, and we will all see how that pans out for them!
rwf April 22, 2013 at 06:08 PM
The Tucker maps are publicly available. Your insight and suggestions will be most welcome.
Jonathan Cribbs April 22, 2013 at 06:10 PM
This story has been updated with an important response from The North Druid Hills Study Group. See above.
RandyRand April 22, 2013 at 06:12 PM
No one is forcing them to stay Dill! Should cityhood become a reality, they can sell their homes at an even higher value and move! It’s still their choice to live in the city or leave! An FYI, I used disputed as the easiest and least wordy descriptor. Nothing is currently in dispute, Tucker has no map, and no bill of consequence so there is nothing actually in “dispute”.
BurningBridges April 22, 2013 at 06:23 PM
@ rwf - I've searched the CoTIB and can only find this (link below), which is just slightly higher resolution. Still, nowhere near high enough to read even major street names. It's very possible I've overlooked the correct link. Do you have a better one? http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-jeJU8krcHeo/UXQ84-MvDXI/AAAAAAAAAIw/jrzsOK40vr8/s1600/ProposedLavistaHills_040513v1.3+sm.jpg
RandyRand April 22, 2013 at 06:28 PM
That appears to be one “unorganized” group over there! They communicate nothing for months and then one member fly’s a trial balloon map, which another group posts, the Patch posts, and the initiating group then denies as theirs. And this is what some are hoping will emerge a valid option to the well organized LCA. What is next from this group? The dog ate our map!
BurningBridges April 22, 2013 at 06:28 PM
@ rwf - figured out what you were saying. You have to log into Scribd, download the .pdf. Sounds easy enough, but it's not exactly intuitive for most folks, though I am embarrassed I didn't figure it out sooner.
Don Broussard April 22, 2013 at 06:32 PM
Thanks for the update Jonathan. Just to clarify: this map was not intended for publication and was not supported by the North Druid Hills Study Group because it had too much detail (council districts), it was too hard to read, and it contained controversial tax proposals that were not supportable. What map Senator Carter saw or used for his bill (SB275), I have no idea.
Nancy April 22, 2013 at 06:41 PM
RandyRand, Really "Should cityhood become a reality, they can sell their homes at an even higher value and move! It’s still their choice to live in the city or leave! " this is your answer for those people who don't want to be included in the "city of Lakside". The houses were bought prior to any of this and someone gets to come along and ram this down your throat!
rwf April 22, 2013 at 06:55 PM
The City of Lavista map has been removed from the City of Tucker Initiative blog and from the file hosting service. I was incorrectly led to believe that I was free to post the map to the blog.
aaronnatl April 22, 2013 at 07:24 PM
Right now there is a little support for this. They have barely raised 5k from the actual residents of this area. They needed special interest money in the form of a law firm looking to get paid on the back end for half the money they have. In a area with the wealth of lakeside you would think if they had so much interest they could raise 30k legitimately in no time. The low turn out at the fundraiser and the low donations leads me to think the loud minority is trying to push through an agenda most of us could care less about.
RandyRand April 22, 2013 at 07:25 PM
Yes , Nancy its called “how things Really work” . It is how things work in Dekalb County today, a majority wanting something or anything, like more parks in South Dekalb, they vote, they get them, and I get to pay more than an equitable share for them! If a majority of people in a defined area votes you into a city you are in! That how it Really works! An knowing this I recommend acting in one’s own best self interest with regards to cityhood. I did not make up these rules, so please don’t blame this messenger for getting something rammed anyplace.
RandyRand April 22, 2013 at 07:48 PM
LCA is less than 30-45 days into its fundraising efforts. I has raised over $10,000 thus far. This puts LCA on course to exceed its goal of $30,000 before the end of July! The LCA has met with thousands of people , other groups have yet meet for the first time! Fran Millar openly stated” LCA” is the only cityhood effort positioned to succeed in its efforts. If this is “little support” aaronnatl, please point out another group with even 1% of this level of support! We are looking for facts here, so bring-em if you got-em!
Ralph April 22, 2013 at 08:44 PM
None of this means anything unless a study is done by UGA or Georgia State. Only proposal I have heard of so far is one to be funded by Lakeside. If Tucker, Smokerise or Druid Hills wants in the game, its time to get serious and raise money. Only areas that are in the study are going to be in or part of a new city. All this talk of a city or cities including Druid Hills, Emory, Tucker and Smokerise means nothing untill someone has a study done. I like to look at maps, too, but maps by themselves don't mean anything.
RandyRand April 22, 2013 at 11:01 PM
Dill, Who is stalking who here? It is you who Dill who hangs on my every word. It is you who is busy checking into my background. It is you who spends his time tracking mine and my family’s personal associations! What kind of an insecure individual does that? And what kind of freak do you have to be to check into when some purchased his home Dill? This is you Dill! The person who lives with some abnormal level of paranoia whereby you believe that someone is taking your park or schools or an undocumented area some call Tucker. You have lost it! Try and get a grip on yourself before you embarass youself any further! And please Dill, Please continue to take all my comments as being worth the weight in gold and continue to repost them! It is important for low info residents to get a taste of realville!
HamBurger April 23, 2013 at 01:41 PM
That is what we thought about conservatives in Brookhaven . . . But, look what happened! Please pass the yellow mustard!
Tom Doolittle April 23, 2013 at 06:03 PM
On Brookhaven--our education "over here" needs to be heavy on relevant news and info from other new cities. For some similarities given the speed with which this area's (areas') city-making process was conceived (or is being conceived in several areas)--I'd say the socio-mechanics of Brookhaven's journey would be most applicable here.
Tom Doolittle April 23, 2013 at 06:18 PM
DeKalb Neighbor--I hadn't seen this--in fact hadn't seen any reports about the Greek Church meeting: http://neighbornewspapers.com/view/full_story/22297964/article-Lakeside-cityhood-exploration-draws-100?instance=dekalb Porter acknowledged legislative hurdles (confusion) persisting with multiple proposals involved.
Ralph April 23, 2013 at 06:43 PM
(Collected in writing from audience and presubmitted via email) Has either institute that will do the study ever had negative conclusions?  It is our understanding that CVI has twice reached negative conclusions about proposed cities, but if the data suggests feasibility, then that is what is reported. To our knowledge, none of those cities that have been determined to be feasible subsequently failed. Have all areas been polled?  No polls have been done by LCA. Some polling could be conducted if sufficient funds are raised. Community meetings, in‐person conversations, email and social‐media interactions are being used to gather community feedback. In terms of the financial viability of a new city, why should residents trust only one study (that of the Carl Vinson Institute)? Economists frequently look at the same facts and come to polar‐opposite conclusions.  House Rules Committee requires study must be done by either Carl Vinson or Andrew Young. We do not have the money to commission two studies; CVI has extensive experience with cityhood economic studies. Why is Henderson Road the boundary instead of Midvale? By having Midvale the boundary, all Midvale Elementary students would be in Lakeside, not just some of them. 
Ralph April 23, 2013 at 06:45 PM
Questions and answers at meeting of April 18. Greek Orthodox Curch. Lakeside Alliance More at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lakesidealliance/files/4_18_13%20Q_A%20from%20meeting.pdf
Herman Lorenz April 23, 2013 at 06:58 PM
Gee, I go out of town for a week and miss all the fun. Personally, I kind of like this map; don't think much of the taxes though.
rwf April 23, 2013 at 07:23 PM
Why Henderson Road boundary? The most logical and reasonable boundary would be along the creek just south of the Evansdale neighborhood. No sharing of streets and no splitting of neighborhoods.
RandyRand April 23, 2013 at 07:54 PM
rwf, It appears from the documented comments that Tucker "leadership" pushed for this as the line of demarcation. So with that in mind, you know where any issues one might have with the reason and logic now rest!
rwf April 23, 2013 at 08:40 PM
Sorry, Randy I'm not familiar with those 'documented comments' and I don't quite understand your last sentence. Are you in agreement?
Georgia April 23, 2013 at 08:43 PM
RWF - looks like ralph copied pasted part of document. There were a bunch of school related questions that are grouped together. Q&A above was copied and pasted, here's complete info from LCA website: Why is Henderson Road the boundary instead of Midvale? By having Midvale the boundary, all Midvale Elementary students would be in Lakeside, not just some of them.  Civic and political leadership in the Tucker areas forced the change of boundary. With regard to school attendance districts, proposed city boundaries and school attendance zones are exclusive of each other. (See section on school‐related questions).
rwf April 23, 2013 at 09:09 PM
OK, those questions, if they are the 'documented comments', then they are not from the Tucker so-called leadership, they are from Patch's very own CM, (rolling my eyes here), and her list of supposed questions that were only meant to confound the LCA. (I must commend the LCA for considering her questions (?) at all.) Regarding the 'civic and political leadership', those conversations were not publicized, and could very easily be one conversation between Millar and the LCA after the Tucker hooligans got themselves all riled up. We really don't know. It's a mystery. The original border basically followed Millar's district line and could just as easily been simply the lack of knowledge of the GIS guy at the state capitol. Tucker has no 'political' leadership to speak of as our legislators are not yet fully engaged, and our civic leaders, who have never been elected by the community at large, are largely drawn from a closed group of maybe one hundred local activists (just a guess). In no way do they speak for all of us, and certainly not for those interested in incorporation. To this point, they are quite determined to pursue their own agenda. If they follow through with raising the funds for the CVI study, I will be duly impressed.
RandyRand April 23, 2013 at 09:24 PM
Once again RWF, I find myself commending your honest and insightful comments here on the Patch. While we don’t always agree, you have always represented the kind of informed person and honest broker the Tucker community really needs. And Tucker would be much better served by engaging you more fully and heeding your counsel. Another cheer for RWF!
Georgia April 23, 2013 at 09:34 PM
GIS mapping at Capitol is by census track, so unless census track runs along natural borders (or man made ones), accounts for funny lines that split streets, etc. I've been involved with the GIS guy there (nor for LCA), they know there stuff. They were deliberate in mapping at GIS office, and met several times to revise, before going public with any map, that's been said at first 2 meetings, at least Tucker has political leadership and it's Elaine/Honey, joined at the hip. I think they may be surprised at reaction, since Honey is still saying that there is no need for a city. By the way, where's the accounting for all the grant money? Would like to have an answer for that. That Q&A list was from comments/questions written by attendees at meeting on 4/18/13 and pre-submitted by email (many from CM, as she posted on Patch, but here were a few others from email). Comment was made at beginning that there were a bunch of long questions by email regarding schools that was not going to be addressed, but would be posted on line. No wonder it took so long for LCA to post them, probably took just as long for them to figure out what CM was asking. They had a stack of cards, probably 45-50 questions, and answered all, some were redundant and they made note of it.
Georgia April 23, 2013 at 09:35 PM
Meant NOT for LCA, not nor for LCA.

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